05/06/2023

Curiosity, Prosperity, and Social Enterprise

interviewing @iamdulma Part II

I am doing my 50 days of learning / writing because of @iamdulma’s 100 days of podcasting. Please read part I if you’d like – it surrounds Dulma’s expertise in DTC strategy and her TikTok stardom. 

Being a multifaceted person with a variety of interests who does incredible deep dives and case studies, how do you balance depth versus breadth?

I consider it less about balancing breadth and depth and more about granting myself the permission to discuss what truly excites me, rather than feeling constrained by sticking to a niche. I understand that this approach may not be suitable for everyone, but personally, I value the freedom it provides.

I've also found a way to navigate this through the hundred-day challenge. It compelled me to consistently deliver every single day, even when I felt uncertain about what to talk about. There were times when I had to record a solo episode and wondered, "What should I discuss?" In those moments, I simply shared what was in my heart and in my mind, even if it meant covering topics that seemed unrelated, such as venture capital in one episode and following your soul in another. It reflects who I am.

I believe the hundred-day challenge served as a motivating factor, pushing me to show up in various ways and embrace the diversity of my content.

Would you say that you’re more curiosity-driven or objective driven? 

I'm certainly driven by curiosity. In fact, I believe my curiosity serves as the underlying theme, primarily anchored in significant questions that resonate with how I aim to make a difference. It's a blend, in a way. Let me explain. One of my deep concerns revolves around exploring how capitalism, business, and technological progress can foster greater prosperity while ensuring equitable distribution.

This particular question consumes much of my attention and influences the majority of the content I create. Even if it may not be immediately apparent to an outside observer, much of what I do can be seen as connected to this overarching inquiry. So, my curiosity emanates from that context.

Of course, there are other subjects that pique my curiosity as well. For instance, I find octopuses fascinating—this might sound random, but I genuinely think they're incredible creatures. I've spent some time watching documentaries and reading about them. However, I wouldn't delve into an extensive exploration of octopuses in the same way I would when examining the impact of interest rate hikes on startup funding.

In essence, my curiosity operates within the boundaries of creating a meaningful impact.

Are you familiar with social enterprise? A lot of the companies that you do cover are incredibly capitalistic, profit driven rather than impact driven. What are your thoughts on the idea of the social enterprise, is that possible in the United States?

I do have thoughts on this topic because it's one of the reasons why I wrote my senior thesis on Warby Parker. I've been interested in social enterprises for quite some time, ever since my college days. It's a broad subject, encompassing a few key aspects. Personally, I'm genuinely enthusiastic about the potential for harnessing the structures, institutions, and mechanisms of capitalism to drive positive change and make a meaningful impact. In theory, this concept excites me greatly.

However, in practice, social enterprise can be challenging. Firstly, there's the question of what it actually means. I see it as a spectrum ranging from highly profit-driven enterprises with philanthropic initiatives added as PR schemes to organizations that operate more like nonprofits but generate profits to sustain themselves. Everything in between exists as well, including various legal entities like nonprofits, B Corps, or standard Delaware C Corps that prioritize social good to varying degrees. The umbrella of social enterprise is complex and fractured, encompassing numerous approaches.

Thus, it's essential to acknowledge this complexity. The right structure for maximizing impact depends on the specific goals one aims to achieve. I recall my excitement during college when I stumbled upon the concept of social enterprise. I thought, "Everything should be a social enterprise!" However, one of my professors wisely reminded me that policy plays a crucial role in many cases. It's not a one-size-fits-all solution. The appropriate structure depends on the desired impact. Are you focused on reducing malaria outbreaks globally or selling products like TOMS shoes? There are different considerations for different objectives.

Plus, while social enterprise is growing, it is still dwarfed by traditional enterprise within the larger economy. Social enterprises can play a role in inspiring other companies to adopt mission-driven approaches or incorporate corporate social responsibility (CSR) measures. However, when we examine the majority of businesses and how they operate, we realize that most are not significantly influenced by these factors. If our ultimate goal is to ensure that capitalism benefits the greatest number of people, we must address how regular businesses, large corporations, and policies impact the equitable distribution of gains.

I am also deeply concerned about technological progress and its implications. Will AI truly deliver the promised prosperity? And if so, will it be distributed fairly? These are pressing questions for me. OpenAI, to their credit, has developed a unique hybrid model, but the fact that they had to devise such an unconventional structure indicates that capitalism, as currently set up, tends to prioritize profit above all else. Unfortunately, this profit motive often becomes the driving force behind societal growth, disregarding moral considerations.

Absolutely. While social enterprises have their place and can inspire change, it is crucial to address the broader issues surrounding regular businesses, large corporations, policies, and the impact of technological progress. We need to strive for a more equitable distribution of resources and consider the moral implications of a profit-driven society.

Do you think one of the factors for social enterprise becoming successful could be measurability? How do you truly measure “goodness” or “impact”?

Yeah I have one more point about that, because then it becomes an intriguing philosophical consideration, right? Well, now there are definitely many criticisms to make about that in the wake of Sam Bankman-Fried and the likes. But effective altruism is all about, let's quantify everything and direct resources to the thing.

Sure, it might be where you're going to have the highest leverage and highest ROI on your “good”. But, that also makes something appear excessively quantifiable when it's not actually the case. And there's also value in the kinds of good we can do that are not measurable. There's a lot to be said for that.

So, the kindest, most humane world won't just be one where we hyper-efficiently allocate resources towards the highest ROI. It will be a world that is genuinely kind and compassionate, despite its flaws. I think with an approach that assumes everything can be quantified, there are many intriguing philosophical questions surrounding this.

If you could give your 18 year old self some advice, what would it be?

Trust your curiosity. Follow it unapologetically, and ask for what you want. 

Find Dulma on TikTok, Instagram, Twitter, and Substack. 

This piece is 36/50 from my 50 days of writing series. Subscribe to hear about new posts.